First impressions of new update.

Home Forums Archived (Inactive) Forums Leap Day LD – General Discussion First impressions of new update.

This topic contains 68 replies, has 18 voices, and was last updated by  azuckuss 6 years, 2 months ago.

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  • #13519

    claudekennilol

    For example, before we could bypass gathering a resource node with trains. Now, by default, we don’t have that option.

    Another big example, we could use stone/wood roads to keep costs lower by balancing the use of these. Now my roads are literally costing twice as much as they used to because I have only one choice which (in addition to having no trains) even more impedes my starting progress as the cost quickly ramps up.

    I’m surprised trains were given for free for so long if the intention was to bar them from use behind a cost at some point. I get that we can get these for free later. But we’ve had these for free all along, now we can’t use the things that weren’t free until later because we have to buy what we’ve gotten used to using.

    What’s the deal with trading?

    I’m hopeful that crafting will be better, and I’m excited about the “skill upgrades”. Obviously I haven’t yet played enough to use either of those features, but I’m looking forward to it.

    #13547

    dornbeast

    I discovered that upgrading a skill doesn’t automatically improve income; I needed to go into the factory and reset the recipe.

    Factories to divert unwanted goods will become more important for people who don’t have trains.

    Recipes are harder to compare now; Curry is worth more per unit, but on my current map, I’m better off with Jewelry because I can produce eight Jewelry, but only four Curry.

    It isn’t the game I started playing – but it’s still great fun, and I suspect I’m going to like it even more now.

    Curse my unemployment! I must scrape together money, for I require trains! And perhaps catapults!

    #13550

    claudekennilol

    As far as I can tell, two people can’t make full value for trading any more. Closest is if one person harvests all the rare goods and the other person combines the final item. Whoever combines the final item gets full value. If one person does all the work, it doesn’t look like the other person gets anything for selling it. This was super useful for helping someone catch up if they join a game late.

    And with gems, since one person can’t gather two different gems, one person gets super jipped because the value of the gem goes up about 5x (depending on the gem) for turning it into a ring. One person gets the ‘1x’ and the other person gets the ‘5x’

    Seems like a huge knock on this being a cooperative game.

    #13552

    claudekennilol

    And by “rare goods” I meant “raw goods”

    In general, it’s just less reason to cooperate because if I give it to my neighbor and they combine then I get less money than if I’d’ve just combined it myself.

    So now the only incentive to trade with your neighbor is either if they’ll give you their gems so they get shorted instead of you giving them yours, or if you absolutely need to to be able to finish a tower.

    So again, a huge step back from this being a fully cooperative game.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  claudekennilol.
    #13554

    jchrisholmes

    My first impression – why do different goods require my prince to be a higher level? That’s a huge immediate turn off. Is this game intended to be about grinding up levels or about skill – because so far everything is about a skillful layout.

    Why are there “level” requirements for different goods?

    #13557

    Daniel
    Member

    @jchrisholmes

    One of the big issues with the game (when we look at the stats) is getting people into the game. When we do usability tests a lot of people are overwhelmed, well by a lot of things. :-) Number of recipes is one of the problems that comes up.

    So we are putting a short advancement system in place for new users. It should take a little over a week to get to level 25 after which all the levels are open. So there is a small period of the game opening up, but it shouldn’t be too long.

    If you’ve been playing for a while, it may still feel slow. But hopefully it will feel quite natural for people who have never played before.

    @claudekennilol
    Keep the comments coming on trading. New system when you trade a good to another player who crafts something: 1) You get the value of the good you traded. 2) Both players get a trade bonus that is a percentage of the final selling price.

    #13558

    dornbeast

    1) You get the value of the good you traded.
    2) Both players get a trade bonus that is a percentage of the final selling price.

    I should note that this produces counter-intuitive results.

    http://leapdaygame.com/index.html?observe=Pub_0b7765cb-34c7-461f-8cdd-46c9752da5dc&player=6&x=92&y=16

    Take a look at Ruthka’s income. She’s selling the rings created on Death561’s land. While this fits the new system, it’s not intuitive to see “+200 gold” coming up next to somebody’s castle and not have it reflected in the income.

    Also, the value of her Onyx does not appear in her itemized list, only as part of her Value From Trading. In my opinion, this makes matters worse – without your explanation, and a careful dissection of the numbers, I wouldn’t understand what’s going on. For somebody who doesn’t read the forum, it’s going to be incomprehensible.

    This change should have been in the Major Update announcement, just to minimize the number of people who are confused by it. It will still confuse people, but both Ruthka and I read the forums, and neither of us could figure out what was going on.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  dornbeast.
    #13560

    Eskay

    Daniel, to keep the things a new user has to consider down, I’d want to get the unavailable recipes out of the way of the available ones.

    I suggest keeping all the available recipes at the top of the list, then sorting the unavailable ones below, in the order they’ll unlock. Build excitement for the next level!

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  Eskay.
    #13570

    claudekennilol

    Things producing variable amounts due to shrines is a very win/lose situation. For example, on the map I’m currently on, one person was completing a shrine that increased the value of wood. Someone else came along and finished a shrine that makes trees produce one more wood. Now the first person isn’t finishing their shrine because they’re being clogged up with wood.

    Sure, more resources is a good thing, but this can directly clog up someone’s production.

    If I have everything set up to make 20k a day, and don’t log in for a day, I’m going to be super pissed if someone comes along and screws up the production I have because everything I had meticulously set out is now screwed up because I’m collecting too much of something. Granted, by the time I’m making 20k a day, all the shrines are probably completed and I should take that into consideration. But if I’m starting out, especially at lvl 6 with so few recipes available, it’s easy enough to get a “good” setup going at 800 a day, while one other person can build to a nearby shrine with one tower and possibly screw me over after I’ve logged out.

    I don’t think the benefit, as it is now, is good enough to counter micro-managing everybody’s placement of stuff on the map to make sure you can’t screw someone over too strongly if you decide to finish a shrine. Likewise, if you do that without micro-managing, it can be too harsh (albeit unintentionally (er, hopefully unintentional)) if you just finish it because you think it’s good while accidentally screwing someone over.

    Back to my first point, roads are way too expensive now that we only have one default option.

    edit: And how exactly do these gold chests work? They seem to show up randomly on my map and I use the contents to “level up my skills”? I can only hold one of each good, and it’s my choice whether or not to use it? Is there more to it than that?

    I feel like the game is much less eloquent now (solved in time with more options for building, but I don’t have any of those options now, and I won’t be receiving crowns for my efforts so won’t have those options for a very long while). It aesthetically pleasing to be able to watch the screen and see how everything was working. Now it all looks the same because I just have stone roads and simply doesn’t look aesthetically the same. I’m having to brute force everything by gathering everything and hoping I can find somewhere to place a building that’ll turn me a profit. Instead of finessing it with trains and being able pick and choose what I want to do (by not having to gather everything nearby).

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  claudekennilol.
    #13582

    claudekennilol

    Finished my first level. Very disheartening to not receive any crowns as they are now more essential after we’ve been “stripped of our former powers”.

    Started another, and again I feel punished for not having a wider variety of options. I see what I can make, but am not able to because there are other resources in the way and I have no choice but to gather them and can’t make what I’d like to.

    After the freedom we had, this is just too limiting.

    Also, I received 4 skill points and don’t see what to do with them :/

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  claudekennilol.
    #13592

    Delha

    My first impression is unfortunately negative… The increased cost due to being unable to offset scaling with wood paths makes it harder to build initial production lines. After throwing together a quick setup worth around 700 or so, it came up that it’s much easier to strip mine (run paths around gathering as many goods as possible and turn them in directly). One person on our level used that method to hit around 1k initial income.

    As of last night, we’ve got two shrines of Fine Wood going, and they guy starting in the forest is at around 1.7k income. A neighbor is at 1.5k or so. I’m one of the two people producing a jewelry for the shrine, and after trying a few different layouts which generally hit the 700-800 range, I tried out their method and immediately hit around 1k. As a side note, the other player completing a shrine is around 600, if I recall.

    Now, part of this is due to the fact that our map has very heavy resource density, so it’s harder to fit in factories. That said, if this isn’t an exceptional case, I’d like to see some adjustments made to prevent the best strategy available from also being the easiest. It’s the same core problem that existed before with statues, but now even more so. If it is indeed an unusual situation, I’d like to suggest that this particular map be tuned to have a slightly less crowded starting area if possible.

    #13594

    claudekennilol

    I agree, it’s disheartening (again with that word) to see someone “strip mining” as Delha so adequately pointed out and making the best profit (or at least near the best) with obvious minimal effort. It’s fun to combine and get a proper layout to make maximal income, it’s not fun to just lay a huge circle of roads, drop some houses, and leave it be. Without trains as options pickup/deliver from shop to shop, we can’t even make use of the spaces that shops actually do fit because of the compactness of all the resource nodes.

    Obviously it seems I’m being overly negative, but that’s just because I enjoy this game, and I want it to work.

    edit: and with the addition of not being able to drop off goods at the same spot we pick them up from, it’s just another hindrance on top of not being able to use the other placing options we’re used to.

    edit: ah, found out about skill points. I found golden chests before I got skill points. So when I went to the training tab there was a big button there to train that it set that one thing apart. Later when I went back to that screen with skill points, I didn’t see anything that set anything apart (and no instructions on how to use skill points) so I assumed I just couldn’t use them yet. Someone in game chat explained it to me. Now that I know it’s there I know it’s there. I probably could have noticed it if I looked closer. I don’t know if this needs to be more plain or not.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  claudekennilol.
    #13595

    joeblowglitch

    I’ll try to restrain myself a bit :D

    – Starting location has no room to locate huge shoppes and run roads in any non-frustrating way. Even though I hated the old resource distribution, I will pray for it to return tonight. Please give us more room to work on day #1 if you want us to return on day #2.

    – Shoppes no longer seem to accept resource input at the output corner. I hope this is a bug, and I started a separate thread in bug forum. This is a big change in behavior from the old shoppes. I can no longer input to the output corner of a shoppe. If you insist on this behavior, make shoppes smaller again. This will somewhat alleviate the issu in the above point too.

    – Recipedia is awful. Just awful. I can’t search on anything and I want third party sites to work again. I agree with previous posts about hiding unloakced recipes, but so much more is needed. How about search? How about a way to easily step through a recipe, like from stone to statue…ya know, something that intuitively makes sense.

    – The golden goods seem interesting and upgrades seem to be cool.

    – No rails and no wood is lame. Not sure about loot drops yet, but seems to be advantage for paying customers so far. Sure, I can play game x to get rails. But when rails will likely be crucial in more difficult game y, why do i have to play game x to be able to manage in game y? Don’t know enough here just yet about drops, but the first game I played give stout towers. Pfft, I don’t want them. How about a menu of items to select from after each game? I can pick stout towers if I pay crowns for unlimited rails/trains, but if I’m poor and don’t want to pay for the game, I can pick a one time ‘standard’ item like rails or wood.

    – Shrine activations. Interesting, but as another stated, too unpredicatable and could cause major grief. If I’m delivering a valuable good on a wood lined street, someone can screw me big time by adding +1 wood. For starters, I’d like to see a list of perks that are currently applied to my land. Ideally, I’d like a way to turn each individual perk on or off. this would avoid undesired changes to my layout.

    Hmm…what else…well, I’ll wait until game 2 is over.

    Some positive things in this release, but lots of frustrating negatives too.

    You guys should play a few games with us. You’ll see what we mean.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  joeblowglitch.
    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  joeblowglitch.
    #13599

    claudekennilol

    Just to expound on my last point on my last post (too late to edit, please remove the time limit on this?)… I see an arrow point to skill points for each skill, but I still can’t see how to spend my skill points..

    I’ve kinda said this above, but I just want to say it again. One of the reasons my wife and I have been playing this game the past few weeks is because when we work together we really felt like we were accomplishing something. Now, it feels only slightly beneficial to trade with your neighbor and just feels “meh”.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 2 months ago by  claudekennilol.
    #13605

    claudekennilol

    Again, hate not being able to edit and overinflating this topic, but I’ve got more to say. I just opened up the game and saw a golden chest out in the snow. I clicked on it and was able to loot it. Yes, I clicked on it because I wanted it, but it was odd that I was able to claim something out in the snow. When I trained with the golden ore I obtained, the number above the arrow on the right side of the training screen went from 10/1 to 9/1. Does this imply that you can only spend skill points when you find golden item to train them on? If so, this is very obtuse and not well reflected. Skill points in every other game I can think don’t have a secondary cost to spend. I was under the assumption that I can spend skill points, and the golden loot was some kind of bonus.

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